Doug Sanders

From the Hearth -
Several weeks before the Millenium Open, I spoke with Doug Sanders on The Golf Show on Sports Radio 1300, in Austin. The footage of his missed putt at St. Andrews thirty years previous, I knew, would once again be shown. I knew also that Sanders had suffered some health problems but was playing golf again, and that he had returned regularly to Scotland for years. Time marches on but it's hard not to be a little envious for the days when Doug Sanders was the cock o' the walk. His opinions on, among other things: caddying, Tiger, the Senior P.G.A. Tour and the Ryder Cup are worth a moment of our time, at the very least as reminders of how far we've come. St. Andrews, he told me, is a part of his life.

The Hearthstone Review: Take me back, if you would, to the dinner at the 1967 Ryder Cup at Champions, when Hogan got up following Dai Rees's introduction of the Great Britain and Ireland squad. Hogan said simply: "Ladies and Gentlemen, the United States Ryder Cup team - the greatest golfers in the world." What was the reaction?

Doug Sanders: Well, I tell you when you had a guy like Ben Hogan, it was unbelievable because the first thing he said; he met us all, he says, "Gentlemen, let me tell you I do not want to have my name on the cup that has lost the Ryder Cup. Do you understand?" 'Yes sir!' you know. The thing that I think that was so. . .You were out there playing for your country but having a guy like Ben Hogan. . . I recall that he would be about six feet from you and he would stop and take a puff off a cigarette and blow it out and walk up, and he says, "You will win today, won't you?" You certainly did not want to come in that evening, that afternoon, and having played and when Ben Hogan came up to you and he was going to ask you, "You did win," you certainly weren't going to say, "No I lost. Not to Ben Hogan. That would not be something…so it put a little extra pressure on you and it made you play a little harder.

THR: The matches were close that year, but we won handily. In recent years it seems the Americans have had trouble with the team formats. What makes a good pairing? And, what do we need to do better to avoid digging such a big hole?

DS: First of all the competition has become unbelievable because it's not just Great Britain anymore. It's the world, more or less. I think more today than ever before…you see, when we played on the tour, we were a family. You knew the wives' names, the kids' birthdays, and all the other things. Today, they said it was about three years ago, they had two playoffs. And the guys had to go out on the first tee and introduce themselves. They didn't even know each other.

THR: It's a whole different deal now.

Sanders: It really is. I think a lot of it has to do with money. 'Well, you know he only made $50M. The other guy, this, that and the other.' First is being a friend. Bob Goalby played with Sam Snead in The Legends, and someone said, "What are you playing with Sam for? He can't play." He says, "Because he's my friend." That's the difference today. And I think if those fellas out there today became a little bit closer, get to know each other and were able to harmonize and work closer together. . . However, that's everybody's own thinking, and that's the way they're goin' to be. And dollars and cents has separated that rather than friendship.

THR: Another difference. I noticed at Pebble Beach you had several international players playing well who had caddie backgrounds. What do players learn from that experience?

Sanders: When you come up through the caddie ranks it's a different thing. When I was about 11 or 12 years of age, one night about 7 o'clock, I'd been looking for golf balls and I stood at the door - they're having a meeting at the club - they says, "Son, are you okay? What's wrong? Can we help you?" 'Yes, sir. Why can't the caddies play?' And they decided that night that the caddies could play on Mondays, Wednesdays and Fridays but they had to be through at 9:30 in the morning.

And that's the way caddies got started. And when you're out there, you're just blessed by being able to walk along the fairways and hit that ball…it's another world. It's like going to the movies for the first time.

THR: I know Harvey Penick didn't like to see kids riding in carts, but you see that all the time.

Sanders: I think it makes a big difference. It just changes the whole thing. You don't have an opportunity to walk along with your buddies and talk and get to know what's about them. Those are the big things because after we used to caddie we used to sit around. First of all, we'd have lunch. What did we have for lunch? I never will forget the commercial. Pepsi Cola. (Sings: 'Pepsi Cola hits the spot. Twelve full ounces that's a lot. Twice as much for a nickel too. Pepsi Cola's the drink for you.') And we could get two cans of pork and beans for 17 cents and a loaf of bread for 11 cents. And that's what we would do, fold it up and eat it up like a hot dog, and there'd be five us and that's the way we could afford it. We were out there. We learned together. We became friends.

THR: You were at Pebble Beach. Put Tiger's week in perspective.

Sanders: Think of it another way. Go back to Sam Snead and Hogan. Look at some of their best years. What ages were they? Thirty-five to 40. Most of those guys turned pro at the age of 25. Then they went on the tour or they got a job. They worked at the clubs in the North. They came to the South: Florida, California, Arizona in the wintertime and they played. Now Hogan told me he had to finish in the top 10 to make $50 when he first started. So they normally didn't make enough money until about [after] five years. It was almost 30, 27, 28 before they ever went on the tour. Now having their best years between 35 and 41. What ages are they? How much experience have they had? They've only had seven or eight years, 10 years of experience on the PGA Tour.

Look at Tiger. First of all, don't forget about equipment, that's number one. Tiger started competition when he was six. At the age of 24, he's had 18 years of experience - but with a 20-year old's touch. Now, can you imagine Sam Snead or Hogan, at the age of 40, with a 20-year old's touch? Man, we used to go out there and try and get that touch and have five or six beers to get us over that creek or something else. But Tiger has that young touch, a lot of experience; he's long, and he's got that burning desire, that killing instinct, that will to win. And I'll tell you the records that he's setting are absolutely mind-boggling to golfers like myself.

At 24, he's had 18 years of experience but with a 20-year-old's touch. Can you imagine Sam Snead or Hogan, at the age of 40, with a 20-year-old's touch? I'll tell you the records that [Tiger's] setting are absolutely mind-boggling to golfers like myself…

THR: What do you see as the biggest impediment to Tiger in dealing with the Old Course?

Sanders: Well, the Old Course is different. It can change so much from day to day. You can go over there and practice for a month and walk out there the next day and you've never even seen that golf course. It'll be 30 years this next month since I missed that little putt to win the British Open at St. Andrews, and somebody says, 'Do you ever think about that?' And I says, "No, sometimes I go as far as five minutes without even thinking about it." But, it's gonna be hard. He's going to have to evaluate to win. It's a war. You want to win the war but you've got four battles. You can lose a battle, you can lose two battles, you can lose three battles, but you can still win the war as long as you don't lose too many troops in one battle. As long as you can stay close. But they're going to be chasing him. He's long. He's got so much game. But I'll tell ya, if that wind blows and howls as it has and can do, you're going to have to learn to play a lot of golf shots. That's the reason that guys who won it so many times, guys like Peter Thomson, Bobby Locke and Tom Watson and Nicklaus and Player - those guys were able to knock that ball down - not so much Jack - Jack just had such long strength back in those days. He beat me twice by a stroke; one in a playoff by a stroke and another time by a stroke.

At Muirfield and Carnoustie and St. Andrews. Well I gave it to him on Saturday but he won it on Sunday. And he's one of the great champions and the great players, and it was great to see him coming down that last hole at Pebble Beach, because he knew he was giving up part of something that he had worked so hard…and the great championships that he's won…my heart went out to him.

THR: You've been going back to Scotland for the past 30 years. Why do you go back?

DS: Scotland to me is a part of home. . . I'm thinking about flying over right now because I've got a good record, and just quickly: I finished second in five majors, four by a stroke and a playoff by a stroke; I lost five playoffs. I won five playoffs. I finished in the top twenty-five 286 times; the top ten 154 times; top three 13 times, 2nd 21 times and I won 20 tournaments on the regular tour. And Tiger tied me. That's the first time that a man to win 20 tournaments in 29 years. Yet, I'm not eligible for the Senior Tour because I didn't win enough money.

THR: There was a time you were top five on the all-time money list.

Sanders: Yea, and, but, so what I do now is a lot of corporate days, which I truly enjoy. I did six outings out at the U.S. Open at Pebble Beach in one week. I enjoy people. I enjoy getting out and playing golf. I'm hitting it straighter than I've ever hit it in my life. I made two holes-in-one the last three outings I've done. You get on the tee and you've got a bunch of groups coming through and you're out there 140-, 150-yards and hit one or two balls with 18, 20 or 25 groups; you at least get a good feel for what's happening.

But I go over to Scotland… A lot of times I'll just take a bunch of my buddies. We'll play St. Andrews and Carnoustie and Royal Lytham, Troon, a little of all the places. It's just kind of good to get away sometimes and to enjoy a little of some of that cool weather in July and August and I'm thinking about going over now on the 15th of July and if I do, which is a Saturday, I get there at about 2' o clock. And I'm there Sunday and Monday and at 6:30 Tuesday morning I'd have to leave because I've got to be back in San Diego Tuesday night to do a corporate day on Wednesday. So it's a long ways to go for a little over a day but I just thought about going back over there and walking down that 18th fairway once again, and having the memories, and they'll always be part of me and St. Andrews is part of my life.

THR: The press will be something Tiger will have to deal with. How did the tabloids treat you in 1970?

Sanders: Let me tell you - the press over there and the people - they put you up on such a pedestal. When I went there I was one of the few guys that ever kind of did something a little different and maybe it was because of the South and I enjoy people, but people over there would see Arnold standing over there and, 'I'd just like to wave at him.' 'Don't you dare wave at him. He's probably thinking about a shot he's going to hit tomorrow.' And they had you on such a pedestal and they were so polite and so nice. They'd always walk down the fairways with us. They didn't have ropes. They walked along the fairway. They were gentlemen, ladies and gentlemen because they respected the game. But I used to go over there and come to the gallery and walk out on the practice tee. . . Now, sometimes the gallery would have to stand fifty, seventy-five, a hundred yards back from where you were practicing. I'd stop and talk to them. 'He spoke. He wasn't sick. What did he say?' I was one of the first guys to stop and start talking with them, opening up. They do have a lot of respect for the game of golf but they put you up on a pedestal that is so high. And they just make you feel like you are royalty in so many different ways.

THR: I wonder if you find it interesting that Tiger, and everyone on tour, seems to want that compact swing. You were very straight with a beautiful high finish but everyone talked about the length of your backswing. When you look at those swings now, what do you think?

Sanders: It just makes sense. I've often said that I think I had the ideal swing in the world for the weekend player, because there's so much less for to go wrong. They said that when I was a younger man that the only time I left the fairway was to get a phone number. I used to play for weeks and weeks, and I still do now…I mean if I went out and played a tournament and missed a fairway in the three days we play on the senior tour, I would probably be more surprised than not. . .It does not go as far…

THR: You talked a little about the regular tour, and the influence of money. What's the matter with the Senior P.G.A. Tour?

Sanders: It's getting to be a lot like the regular tour. A lot of those guys are coming on. . .Whenever we used to play on the regular tour, you'd come in and play on Friday, if you were playing Friday morning there'd be ten people in there: 'Hey, did you make the cut? I'll go with you. I'll buy dinner tonight. How about breakfast in the morning?' 'Oh do I have to? Okay, I'll do that. I'll ride with you. Come on.' They had eight, 10, 12 people that never had a car. They'd travel with you. Today, you go there and you see the kids sittin' around at the different tables - 10 guys at 10 different tables - 'Well, why aren't you sittin' over with him?' 'Oh, he just bought this new airplane and it only seats eight. The only thing he wants to do is talk about the airplane.' 'The other guy over there, says he's talking about buying a helicopter. I'm bettin' you $50 he's not worth $100M.'

'Now, that guy I played with over there? He's talking about how much money he made last year on tour. A hundred dollars says he didn't make $30M.' Why would I want to listen to that? Well what they do: they fly in their airplane. They don't get to meet anybody. They get to the other airport. They have a limo to pick 'em up, take 'em to the hotel. And their driver, caddie, or themselves drives them out to the golf course, and they go right in, change their shoes, go out to the practice tee, practice, come in, go back to the hotel, have dinner in their room and get up the next morning, same thing. So they don't really get to live, to enjoy, out there anything like we did. I feel sorry for them but it's their choice. But it's so popular today that they just don't want to get out there and fraternize with the people.

What they do: they fly in their airplane. They don't get to meet anybody. They get to the other airport. They have a limo to pick them up, take them to the hotel. . .They don't really get to live, to enjoy, out there anything like we did. I feel sorry for them. . .

THR: I have to ask you what your closet looks like these days?

Doug Sanders: Well, I still have got a lot of shoes. I've always enjoyed clothes. It's been part of me but I have really enjoyed the fact that the people have enjoyed seeing what colors and everything I've been wearing. And, again, I'm just enjoying being out there and doing all the things I'm doing. As I said, I'm doing more corporate outings this year than I've done in a long time. I've come back after my major operation on my neck and God's given me an opportunity to change a lot of my life. And I tell ya, I'm one of the happiest gentlemen I've ever been in the world. A lot of my life has changed. I joined a church, got baptized. And I just tell ya:

This is just a different Doug Sanders than I used to be. And I'm proud of the old one. Of course, I'll tell you one thing else: I've certainly enjoyed the one that I've lived with for a long time. So, I think you get out of life what you put in it. And the things I've done for junior golf and for charity…they say whenever you die the only thing you can carry with you is whatever you gave away so hopefully I'll be very pleased because I have been able to give little things and this game of golf has been one of the most wonderful things in the world to me. And as I've often said in my life: I think I'm one of the richest men in the world because I weigh measure wealth by friendship and I tell ya, I'm a rich man.

© THR, 2000

Talking Points - Edition I - Ron Green
Talking Points - Edition II - Dr. Patrick Cohn
Talking Points - Edition III - Bradley S. Klein